picking up on the friends thing.

She probably knows you still have feelings. She may not know. She may not undestand limerence and it being painful. But that is why in your situation I would probably tend towards disclosure, especially as she seems not to be a core part of your life and it is easy to walk away from for both of you.

But flip the script a bit on remaining friends/confusing her. Ask yourself how would I behave if you knew your friend found being around you painful because they had feelings and you’ve rejected them already.

Would you:

(a) cut them off and hope that it will be the best for them long term
(b) talk to them about it and see if you can resolve their feelings somehow and make it clear they need to move on
(c) try to help them find alternative partners, also signalling that this will not be with you
(d) just carry on as is, even though you know it hurts them

Limerents are great at convincing themselves this means a lot to LO too, rather than just being a nice bit of attention/fun friendship, and if it all went away it would be a rather insignificant episode in their life. The LO is not responsible for your pain and decisions you make, but they are responsible for deciding how they react to that and if they willingly prolong it then that is on them.

Aaagh, Owen, I feel for you. Your story could in many ways almost be mine. But things are going to get better for you now, you are doing the right thing.

First up , the good news, as many people above have posted developing self-awareness etc. and deciding to do something about your situation in your mid 20s is a good time, you have a big chance to make a difference. I had a very similar backstory (below), but clocked on (20 years ago) that something very odd was up with me, which I now know is limerence, and now have kids, wife, love my job/career, happy life etc….. well as much as anyone does, we all have our own other issues outside of our love/self centered lives.

Bad news – limerence doesn’t go away. And there is a strong chance you may carry around this lost period of your life with you , so it is good to be conscious now about trying to ‘come to terms’ find closure blah blah with what you may have missed out on. Being as purposeful as possible now will bring you that, and also probabyl dating more broadly.

To save you reading my backstory below, I will try and summarize my advice.

(1) date (or whatever else…) the girls you are not super keen on but be very aware of limerence creeping on you. Just have fun with different women, in a nice way, go on dates, get into grey zones, walk away when you feel something is not right etc. – my biggest regret I carry around is the girls i sometimes literally shoved out of my bed, ignored obvious overtures etc. Women make their presence known when they are interested, but they very rarely make a direct approach. They will jstu be always seemingly hanging around. You may occasionally misinterpret friendliness for interest, or lead someone down the garden path, but as long as you are polite and thoughtful about it with good boundaries you won’t do anyone any long term harm. Just ask people on dates and dont pass up opportunities unless you really think you are going to hurt someone as they are way too into you, which is obviously a no-no. Dont be hruting other limerents…..

(2) Dr Ls advice about the mindset change is absolutely key – get to know someone, and think about whether they are compatible, wiht a basic view that they probabyl are not and the postiive is to be proven. I would also add ‘am I having fun with them’. Short or mid term fun is also fine. Dont be seeking that one big love, that is a classic limerent trait which for me was incredibly limiting. My now SO was one of my best friends and we would just spend hours chatting or going out to clubs, and the first time we ended up, well, ahem, there was miimal chemistry for both of us, but we both realized we wanted to spend more and more time together. Lots of other people have lots of other models of love, try to get away from a limiting mindset of seeking mutual limerence.

(3) All the purposeful stuff is super important – your interests are also things you can talk confidently about, share with someone, you bring something to the table. Maybe its hiking groups, running groups, concerts, shows, clubs, associations, voluntary work etc. etc. try the things you think you might like, most likely you will meet actual people. I didnt grow up in dating app world, but I think i would be looking to meet people in real life even now. You want a partner who shares mutual interests/hobbies, not all of them, but at least some.

(4) Get physically fit, dress well, smell good, tidy your room – you dont need to be a gymbro, the algorithms will try to take you down that rabbithole, but this is just a basic necessity. Be active, and don’t overeat. Weights 1-2 times a week are never going to hirt, but e.g. yoga and lots of walking is also fine, swimming, whatever it is. You are looking for a partner, you should want to give them the best version of yourself, and you should want to be the best version of yourself. This might all be a bit basic but bookish young men I think often forget some real basics like showering twice a day, regularly having clean bedsheets, regular heaircut, always having Deodorant on/with them, shaving, cutting toenails, well fitted clothes (also very easy cheap on e.g vinted). Women like something to get excited about, especially their partner.

So my backstory, fairly similar to yours. I had several short relationships, young people lovey dovey sort of stuff before I was 20, mostly around 2 months, then one longer one of around 4-5 months which may have been approaching mutual limerence, but then I just imploded becuase of my own self doubts and depression and completely sabotaged it. The limerent traits were always there in some form, but I think at 19-20 no one is a fully formed limerent, well apart from perhaps Dante….

Then just went into complete lockdown, 5-6 years where I got into a really bad place mentally and physically, LOTS of self medication, hugely overweight, and massively underperformed my potential. I got some decent degrees, but had been told my whole life I had the potential to be getting top marks at the best unis etc. in everything but was wasting myself, and I did for a long time, probably until my 30s. I was just crippled by self doubt and completely befuddled.

LO1 was right at the start of this and went on for 3-4 years. I rejected several cute girls i had mild interest in for no good reason, more or less escorted 2-3 girls out of my flats/rooms when their intentions were obvious etc. I had a backstory which you can find in various older posts, I was close to my father when i was young and then he became an alcoholic and emotionally completely, abset, or vacant, it is hard to describe, so it wasn’t just limerence, but the two things seem to be heavily intertwined. Anyhow, somehow at the peak/trough of depression where I was pretty close to ending it all, and started once, i met LO2 and we somehow ended up back at mine and then dating for like 4-5 weeks. She is probably one of the best looking women I’ve dated, most intelligent, most shared interests/hobbies etc. and I just fell super hard, but like you was crippled by my own self doubts and she was coming off the back of a messy breakup and it was pretty brutal how anxious i was and some of the ways I embarassed myself. It may not have worked out anyway but i became limerent, spiralled completely and ended up in the dreaded friend zone. I became more self-aware after that and it was probably the last time limerence was brutal, with minor episodes since then and a relapse last year on LO2 which brought me to this site and all the good learnings about limerence.

Just one last advice. Don’t be her friend. You can’t. Disengage in friendly manner. If you need to tell her why then do that, it may be better actually to disclose, but being her friend right now is going to hold you back. You can always be friends again in the future once you have found a new way and if your limerence for her truly ends.

My husband was 57 when he first met me 🙂 he had his last two relationships when he was 17 and 32…

Mmmh yeah, meeting my husband with 28 felt late for a girl in my situation because I never had a real relationship before. But these things highly depend on the cultural context. Just my personal opinion. I felt terrible when teenagers around me had relationships with 14 or 15 and I didn’t. I don’t know which depth and quality their relationships had. But I felt like something was wrong with me. I was picked on. When I was 18, someone told me: “You do not even have someone to …”.
I had a crush on one or two boys during my adolescence, but they were really shy and not ready for a relationship which was ok.

I don’t want to put pressure on anyone, no, that’s not what I was trying to say, sorry…
I just wanted to encourage others. Probably, everyone around here will find what they’re looking for. I stopped believing a long time ago but luckily, it worked out.

28 is really late?

Our marriage even survived my limerence 🙂 It was hard and still is. You know what caused me to be limerent for some hyper-male, authoritarian, married and manipulative colleague? It will be quite hard for me and my husband to have children and biology kicked the “back-up partner” thing. My husband did nothing wrong. As his mother was a non-diagnosed gamble addict, my husband understood that my limerence was an addiction for a person and he fought it with me.

Quite late (and not dating), I have found my personal happily ever after 🙂

Owen,

I copied some of the content of one of the videos I watched:

“There are good dates and there is practice for good dates. It’s not exactly fair or even accurate to consider any date that doesn’t lead to connection, sex or a relationship as a failure, and if you approach dating with this mindset, you’re very quickly going to get burnt out. Most first dates will not lead to second dates so being able to reframe anything that doesn’t lead to a second date as a learning experience will help prevent you from becoming angry, disappointed and demoralized. Some people are reluctant to even go out on a first date with someone when they don’t believe there’s any possibility that it could lead to a long-term relationship. This attitude is problematic for the following reason: If you only go out with people who you
believe are strong fits for a long-term relationship or with people you are extremely attracted to, you’re just not going to go out on many dates and this is going to make you rusty. The ability to have interesting conversations, the ability to flirt, the ability to seduce — these are skills. I don’t care how hot or rich or awesome you are. These things generally don’t come naturally to folks. Like any other skills, they require practice to hone and an effort
to maintain and if you’re not going out on a lot of dates to keep these skills sharp, what’s going to happen when the perfect
guy or the perfect girl suddenly sits down next to you at the bar
or you actually match with each other on the app? You might blow that chance because you haven’t kept a hand in the game now. I’m not advocating that you go out with people that you have zero attraction to but dating regularly helps you get better at dating and reduces the likelihood that you’ll blow a good chance when you get one those opportunities that don’t come around every day. It’s important to be ready for them when they do present themselves.”

I thought that was exactly what we were talking about.

In terms of your LO, I’m assuming you’re still limerent for her ? Other posters will disagree, but I don’t think you can be friends with an LO. Not if you still have feelings for them. And if you’re still all wrapped in her, you won’t exactly be motivated to date other women. Aside from the fact that those other women can’t possibly compete with the fantasy that is your LO. It’s a not a fair fight. 🙂

Hi,

Cheers for sharing, your line “that happiness was a possibility for me” is genuinely quite reassuring to hear. Similarly to what you said, I’ve felt at times it wouldn’t be possible for me, I had certain things when I was a lot younger, and then during my early twenties, as Dr L referenced, I had issues with addiction and self medicating. But it’s encouraging to get the perspective, from multiple people here, that you can keep trying and it can happen.

Thanks again!

Marcia,

“You have a bit of an advantage over the rest of us on here because you are young. You should still be able to meet people IRL who are single and available and around your age. So take advantage of it!”
That is true haha, I definitely need to try and push myself out of my comfort zone a bit more and try and do things that’ll let me meet more new people again.

That’s definitely interesting about the lengths of dates, I never really thought about that. With LO, when we went out, it was definitely the longest period of time I’ve been out on dates for, which at the time I thought was a good sign. We got on really well and had fun to the point it wasn’t really a conscious decision to be out that long, but that is something I’ll keep in mind in the future.

“You and every other limerent. 🙂”
Yeah, I’ve definitely come to realise that is a common sentiment from reading here, which is obviously why so many of us find it hard to break it off even if you know it’s for the best.

“And selfish of her as she probably knows you have feelings but she’s still getting some male attention.”
Honestly, I haven’t really thought about it from that perspective, but I guess realistically as you say she must realise that I still have feelings, even if I’ve never been great at expressing that. That is food for thought.

Genuinely I’m really appreciative of the comments and advice from everyone, it’s not something I’ve ever felt comfortable being able to talk about with friends or family.

For what it’s worth, I met LO #2 a month before I turned 27. The first date I remember was when she took me to lunch on my 27th birthday. Over 40 years later, I still remember where and what it looked like.

My stories of LO #2 are scattered all over LwL. Many of the posts are very uncomplimentary but I will say this:

That young woman showed me that happiness was a possibility for me. For a lot of reasons, I didn’t think it would be. For the first two years we were together, I was happier with LO #2 than I’d ever been.

It didn’t work out for us but my attitude was “that one didn’t work but maybe the next one will.”

It took a few tries before it did, with the exception of one trip down the rabbit hole that landed me on LwL.

As far as I’m concerned, my life began at 27.

Owen,

“So perhaps as you say looking into some new groups and activities might be a good idea in the long term.”
You have a bit of an advantage over the rest of us on here because you are young. You should still be able to meet people IRL who are single and available and around your age. So take advantage of it! 🙂

“when we went out they were quite long dates, from the afternoon til the early hours of the morning, but she ultimately said to me it felt more like friends to her.”
I am by no means an expert, so I’ve watched a lot of YouTube videos by dating coaches. The general consensus is … don’t go on long dates. Two or three hours, tops. Leave them curious about you. Don’t give everything away at once.
I’d recommend TheSingleGuy. American guy. Maybe 30 or 35 years old. He gives dating advice for men, but I watch him to get the male perspective. It’s how to ask a woman out over text, how to text to keep her interest, how to tell if she’s into you, etc.

” I don’t really want to cut out that friendship and potentially hurt and confuse her over stupid feelings I still have. ”
You and every other limerent. 🙂

“Even though I’m aware that it’s still probably overall being selfish on my part thinking like that.”
And selfish of her as she probably knows you have feelings but she’s still getting some male attention.