Honestly, OBW (OBH!) I think yes. I have thought about this so much in the past few days. I feel…in the past several years…that I have developed a really deep rage about the man’s world…

I definitely think that the horror at older women’s bodies (and by extension, minds) runs so deep in the world, that it’s like the air we breathe.

But, I also see a lot of hope in how younger women are seeing their bodies. As a Gen X, I’m actually eagerly awaiting the day the Millenials go into peri-meno. Because they love to bring things out into the open. Then, when Gen Z hits it….whoa. It may actually become an accepted thing to just…get older.

Despite all the influencer culture, and all the emphasis on keeping age at bay, I also believe there are many very connected younger women who are better at seeing the “big picture” than I was at their age. While I may miss that bus due to being in my late 40’s now…I am excited to know that there does seem to be some change in the air…at least, I believe there is. And I believe it’s at a cultural level, which, once it takes root, can be virtually unstoppable. That can be one of the most beautiful parts of humanity…that undercurrent.

Adam,
Your wife sounds like a gem…she sounds like a very strong person.
I understand about growing closer. My SO doesn’t know about my limerences.

I have been thinking about the “intrusive thought” aspect. I think, in some ways, that is the most destructive part of an LE.

One thing that has helped me, personally, in my “Mature Limerences” (middle-age episodes…) which I did not know in my Early Limerences (episodes when I was in my late 20’s) is that it’s kind of like having the flu. It is awful and it is very, very disruptive. But it is not forever, and it WILL pass. Mindfulness has helped me to “keep the faith” in this regard…faith that I will feel better, and that I will move on. I don’t know when. And I can’t control when. But I know I WILL. That is a key.

I also suffer from fairly severe rounds of depression – so I have learned that coping techinque, of seeing an episode as a kind of bout with the flu, but not fatal, and I apply it to lots of things, now.

I hope tomorrow is a great day for you.

OBNW, you are definitely not alone. And not alone in how you feel about your SO either. There is a truly bonded love between my SO and me…but one person can’t be everything to someone else. And into that little space…came the glimmer. ugh!

I think it sounds like it’s the same scenario for you….

The result, for me at least, has been is a messy mix of guilt, longing, dishonesty…anxiety…shame…I know if I were single, and going through this, I would feel…anxiety…will he reciprocate? does he like me? etc… But I would not have the guilt, shame, feelings of dishonesty…that are integral now, because of the feeling I am on the fringes of betraying my committed relationship.

Then, based on our conversation, is all the internal stuff…between us and ourselves. The “me” in the middle of all these whirling things… And her point in life, independent of others!…and whether she has given enough to herself. And the love I have for myself, and how I want to treat myself to the best life I can provide…And all of that. Have I done for myself? Time is moving on! I must make hay while the sun shines! It’s like an annoying parrot sitting on my shoulder. :/

It is all incredibly complicated to navigate. I think, especially for people who are not young…who have truly realized they are not able to go backwards…(I have seen some people, men, mainly, realize this at 80. For women, it mainly seems to happen around 50’s.)

I have a history of intense flames for people. But…they pale in comparison to the sh*tshow of these relatively minor midlife limerences that have made me question every nook and cranny of my life. That, and not the rest, is the absolute worst part. I can honestly say that.

And yes! Older But Hotter. I love it.

OBW

I’ve been thinking on this a lot since LO left a year ago. How I changed “for her” (which is what it looked like to co-workers and my wife). I think LO was just the catalyst for some desire to grow into the person I am now. It may not have been the best way for all involved, like getting in a drunken car accident before getting sober.

I’m starting to see what Miss Lovisa calls the “good” parts of limerence. It tested my resolve to be faithful to my wife. It opened up this person that was inside me that didn’t know how to get out. LO just brought that out in me. From my outside fashion to the confidence to be just me, without caring about what other people think. Loosing weight and eating better might have be a subconscious desire to look attractive to LO. All of it may have been LO and the limerence but the results stayed past LO leaving. (I’ve gained a few pounds back but don’t tell my doctor. I still have six months before my checkup.)

I think the limerence brought my wife and I closer together. There maybe aspects of our marriage that need help; time to heal. But when you can cry in your wife’s arms because your limerent brain is obsessing about another woman with intrusive thoughts and she consoles you … that’s better than when LO was around and we’d fight quite a bit about her. I was very hesitant to disclose to her back in January when I found this community. But I am glad that I did. Her support has been very helpful in speeding up the process of getting out of this LE. I think it has been about a month since that last intrusive thought.

But even talking about LO here the thoughts are far more objective and posted here in hopes to help others like others have helped me. Let me get through my last test, June 3 (one year since she left) as far as intrusive thoughts and I will be on the road to a clear head. Here’s to the new me.

I’m glad I went back up after my last reply to you, because otherwise I would have missed this. Likewise, likewise! I enjoy your replies very much. You have a feel about you like my very best, good girlfriends. Your humor (“perverted old biddies”? hahaha), and your eloquence (“branch is private, it’s heavy, and it cannot be something he will share” – wow, just wow. I love writing, and this is so evocative.) You have a sense of humor about yourself (that story of your grey hair flying, I could just see it!) and I can totally see why your young men are captivated by you! And, I love that you introduced me to the idea that I might actually be hot. I mean, my experiences with my young men have made me at least think I am at least not frumpy, but actually hot? A 9 or a 10? With friends like you, who needs an LO to boost my confidence, hahaha. So, thanks to you I actually posted a photo of myself in a swimsuit over the weekend on social media. Wahaha. What middle-aged woman does that? But … you know, I looked at that photo and I did think it was not bad at all! Mummy tummy (discretely hidden) and all. Lol.

I have almost exactly the same situation with my SO. I am changing too, fundamentally, existentially. I actually see the whole LE as just a part of my late flowering after years of being asleep. The forcing of me awake. It saddens me terribly that my SO does not feel a part of this. There are decisions to be made.

I look forward to your next story! 😀

“I like the fantasy. Not so much the reality. … I want…to be desired.”

It keeps coming back to this. Women consistently say we want to be desired (the men are more a mix of they want to rescue and/or be desired). And by desired, I think we mean a visceral, non-intellectualized desire. I am, objectively/intellectually, desirable as in I tick all the boxes a woman of my age and place in life. But who wants to be a check list? I want to be wanted as a woman. I want to play the desire game. I want that hot look in someone’s eyes when they look at me, not some cool weighing of my value as a companion on some invisible scale. By that token, the more involuntary the attraction the better.

So I’m glad things I say are helping you too because it helps me to read what you say, a lot. And I’m glad to make someone else’s life better from this debacle. Your messages are a balm. I feel less alone in my experience. Less alone in being triggered by a young man’s desire for me. Sometimes I think it is their desire rather than themselves that is so appealing (despite all the other charms we listed of them). It is the desire (and what it says about ourselves) that glimmers for us. Who is reciprocating who first? That moment is often hard to catch.

Instead of Limerent Object, we should call them Limerent Desire (LD). Love me some acronyms, this site is full of them.

And when you start thinking about the “reality” of the person and situation – that is when the mental calculus is being made. The meeting with family (urk), all of life’s logistics and people’s quirks. None of those make it into fantasy land! But maybe we should dwell on those more as a deprogramming strategy. Certainly thinking about the vast amounts of school debt these young guys carry is sobering (I am, for the most part, a very practical woman). My LO has a lot of hang ups, and objectively speaking, he would be a very high-maintenance boyfriend for anyone. I’m not sure, if I were the correct age to “make a life” with him, I would choose to do it. I would instead choose over again, someone like my SO. I prefer to be the adored, pampered on in my relationships, and much as I like the idea of lavishing adoration on a lost-but-not-too-lost young man, that would get old pretty fast (pun intended)

“how happy I am when my mind is clear, vs. how tortured and unproductive I am when I’m having an LE” Yes, I realize I have no problem with the desire, it is when my reaction to it is out of control that I have an issue with it. A bit hypocritical of me, considering all my comments about wanting someone else to be involuntarily desiring me. But like you say, being honest here.

I have heard of Yoga Nidra, but not actually done it. With your recommendation, maybe I will hunt down an actual class. Thanks for mentioning it.

I’m also considering changing my handle from Older But Not Wiser to Older But Hotter, what do you think?

Oof. @olderbutnotwiser — you are in a very bleak mood, indeed. But, at least you are honoring the “honesty” component of the original post…haha. I literally laughed at the pleasures of geriatric care mention. Gah.

Hm. Maybe you can be “hot *and* old”. Why the heck not.

But…I also think you’re right in saying that even though we might be able to attract them, the chances of KEEPING them are slim. I think maybe the best way to look at the youngers is to enjoy them, but not too much.

But…I would also say that if I think about it, I would not want to keep one. I would only want one around on *my* terms. I think that’s what my LE is really about. I like the fantasy. Not so much the reality. Do I want to sit at a boring brunch with him after we’ve been together for a while? No. Do I want to learn that he doesn’t replace his toothbrush enough? No. Do I want to deal with his Mother, his Sisters?…His Friends? NO. So, I don’t really want a relationship. I want…to be desired. And I wish I could control the duration of that desire…I wish I could control the remaining youth in my body….

But I can’t.

The thing I *might* be able to control are my emotions. But even that…it’s dicey. I think your advice, which I keep coming back around to, of keeping your eyes open and a clear head, is warranted. Actually, that has helped me a great deal in the past few days, as I’ve tried to sort through all this.

Knowing I’m not alone has helped…and thinking about how happy I am when my mind is clear, vs. how tortured and unproductive I am when I’m having an LE…it’s like night and day.

I’m sorry you’re feeling bleak. I understand for sure.

Have you ever heard of Yoga Nidra? It’s not movement based yoga, it’s a kind of relaxation technique. It has really helped me in finding inner reserves. I am not a “meditator”. It’s more of a guided thing. And you just…lie there. But it is yoga, and it does foster the mind/body connection. I did not know this, but Yoga actually means “Yoke”, as in to yoke the mind and body. They need to work together…. There’s a lovely woman on YouTube named Ally Boothroyd, her sessions are free and really high quality.

Sh*t. Now I’ve turned into a middle age woman who talks yoga. This is the complete opposite of what I ever thought would happen. Bring on the billowing linen pants. :/

Older But Not Wiser, you are cracking me up.

I guess that women can lose their value with age. Not all of us. I met a beautiful woman on the trail today who is old enough to be my mom. She was on mile 7 when I was on mile 4; both of us started from home and she lives further from the trailhead than I do. I was impressed with her beautiful skin, lovely figure and stamina. She also had a sweet and sincere disposition. She was stunning. I have hope that I will age like her. I might. My aunts are beautiful ladies. My grandma and her sisters were beautiful ladies. I have hope for me and my sister. Anyway, it doesn’t matter that much because I believe in traditional family relationships. I intend to be with my SO forever. If one of us dies young, the other will just have to pick from whoever is on the market at that time. I seem to attract high quality men so I’m not worried about it. I can’t remember, but it seems like you’re married, too.

LE,
“If all you’re looking for is sex, age doesn’t matter. As you note, as long as both parties are above the age of consent, it’s legal. However, you put up any 40+ individual against an 18yr old and it’s not a fair encounter. Any 40+ individual should be able to run circles around an 18yr old. Or, most 20 somethings for that matter. Experience makes a difference and you can leverage that experience to achieve your ends. Wealth, power, status, and even recognizing your target has poor self-esteem are potent weapons.”
Yes, totally agree. It’s a power imbalance. It’s legal but it’s morally questionable.
And, let’s be honest, most 20-somethings want to date people around their age. Everybody’s at the height of their physicality at that age. It just makes sense.

I wonder if it is a vestige of the patriarchal society we live in? There is, by default, a gender power imbalance between men and women. It is somewhat nullified by age when it comes to older women-younger men, but exacerbated by the older man-younger woman. And neutral in any homosexual pairing.